RANT: Features cameras SHOULD have but DON’T

Publicēšanas datums 21 feb 2020
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Niko, Sam, and Wren explain why pro cameras aren't keeping pace with phones and consumer models when it comes to modern filmmaking, and suggest some features they would love to see in the near future!
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komentāri

  • 5:56 the OG iPhone was a phone, internet, and iPod...... that was its whole goal . and as much as a hate apple..... combining everything WORKED REALLY GOOD!!!!! i wish more companies realized this... . they would make more by having one product that does all amazing VS forcing people to buy 3 things that does 1 thing great, and the others like poop . people arnt going to buy 3 cameras they are going to buy one..... and hack, mod, and use software... to make it do the other things they want

  • so what your saying is..... . RED is overpriced and over-hyped..... which is what ive been saying for years hell, id take a nice nikon over a RED

  • "The year is 2020, there's not a better time to be alive if you're an independent filmmaker." Oh precious child.

  • I totally agree. Having onboard support for those things would smooth workflow in a lot of cases. For the more extreme and complex situations? Yeah, strap extra gear on. But that shouldn’t have to be the only way for these cameras that are priced like they’re made out of precious gems.

  • "No better time to be alive if you're an independent film maker" 😬😬

  • 8:44 Lan saying "Jack in, Megaman! Power up!" always replays in my head whenever i hear this phrase.

  • For wireless audio I would prefer manufacturers choose something like Kleer instead of Bluetooth. If you are going to spend upwards of $10,000 dollars on a camera with wireless audio, you might as well have one of the best wireless audio system in it. Kleer wireless is very close to wired sound quality (in fact they are CD quality), has lower latency, and MUCH lower power consumption.

  • yeah, maybe an alexa and Red isnt for vlogging and "easy user experience" - its for "best skin tone" and "timecode-input for teamwork"

  • Basically you want a combination of RED camera, GoPro, IPhone and RayCon?

  • Or maybe Apple needs to release a mirrorless professional cinema camera with all of these recommended features, which would revolutionize and disrupt the current industry

  • 1:38 "In fact, you can go out there and you can _buy..."_ ...ah, well. Hardware manufacturers counting their money, nodding sympathetically as you complain how expensive it is to get the features you want. 2:36 Little known fact: the United Focus Pullers are a very powerful union.

  • 0:10 might have to disagree with that

  • The Sony FX9 has a built in gyroscope that records data so you can stabilize it in post via Sony Catalyst. it is super handy and works REALLY well. It also have incredible autofocus! May be a camera y'all should check out!

  • Everyone knows that the iphone 1 had the best camera

  • teradek make a module to go on the back of your red to transmit wireless video

  • Honestly some of these issues are performance. Those high end cams are at the highest resolutions. You have to down sample on a dedicated encoder for some of those features

  • Can you guys please stop with that advertising in the middle of every video ? It's unnecessary and annoying .

  • I thought you guys were gonna sell the perfect camera lol

  • Wondering if any companies have reached out you at all since this vid! Great vid btw and hope you guys come across some solutions!

  • i think the red can't process fast auto focus and record compress write data if they would do an good auto focus and it would have to encode 8k footage and then have an algorithms to track

  • My issue with all these issues are they only effect a small percentage of the people who may use the camera. RED, Arri and kind of BM and Canon's higher end cameras are aimed at a professional shoot. You'd have a steadicam or track / dolly for smooth shots, focus puller so no need for auto focus, Arri have now actually put a wireless system into some of there cameras but still if certain DoPs want certain monitors then it may not be compatible so easier to use a 3rd party wireless system. Again for sound, you have a sound recordist, the camera would be huge if you add that feature to it. The will have radio mics on actors as well as a boom and have to mix the audio fading up and down for the dialogue so the camera couldn't do all that. The VFX point I agree with as the number of times there isn't a VFX supervisor on set and there is a debate on what info we should note down for them, so the camera doing it all would be good. I think there are enough cameras for the lower end shoots the do all of those things and for the bigger cameras there just isn't the need for it.

  • Is it time to apologise to Linus Tech Tips?

  • Hi, guys, I've been watching your videos and they are really great, but here I think you're wrong for two things - The autofocus and the stabilization. You see, the Blackmagic pocket CINEMA camera is a CINEMA camera, obviously. There's no need for autofocus. It's not made for vloggers, its made for filmmaking. Also, about the stabilization, you can just buy a lens with stabilization. Keep up the quality content!

  • The problem with built in digital stabilization is that it makes your footage look like absolute shit

  • To be honest I think it’s all about demand. Since they aren’t supplying these features, they don’t need improvement them. And since they don’t have those features they don’t need to supply them. It’s simple

    • To be honest I think since your phone can do these things they don’t want to make them because the people that would want them a phone might be good enough

  • I flipped this on 3 months later than the upload. "The year is 2020, it's the best year for independent film makers!" Oh boy do we have a surprise for you...

    • Oh yes they do. Unfortunately, I'm from 3 months in your future, and the surprises just keep on coming. But fall is just right around the corner, so there's that.

  • Does movie cameras also have these problems too?

  • There is a simple reason for why most of these features are not in cinema cameras. When you talk phones you talk about software and hardware being made by the richest companies on earth with huge r&d teams, and in the case of GoPro the whole product relies on some of those features and usability. And in both cases they have a much much bigger market than cinema cameras. Which brings me to my last point, development and product live time; because professional equipment is so expensive, you expect it to use (and be relevant) for a long time (not only cameras but also like music studio gear, lab equipment, etc) and because of the niche market, the high prices, low production numbers, it takes a lot longer to develop these products (RED doesn’t come out with a new flagship camera every year I assume). So all I am saying is it will take them a few years to catch up with the things big tech introduced really just a couple of years ago.

    • I just remembered seeing the FreddieW video shot on the first HD iPhone camera. He strapped it to a balloon or some thing. You might still be using cameras that where around when he shot it, think about that.

  • Yeah, I mean can't they just make a camera where I point at someone and just say "Tom Cruise" and have it deep fake Tom Cruise over my subject? Gawl, come on guys. Lol.

  • IBIS adds some complications with the architecture of the camera sensor. for example, putting IBIS in an alexa LF or an alexa mini moves the sensor by a couple of millilitres and that is more than enough to cause problems with the lens and how the light gets received. so this means they have to invent a new mounting mechanism for the lens and a whole new world of lens mount converters and all kinds of attachments and accessories. or the alternative way, release a bunch of new lens that doesnt need all these attachments just to make a 50mm lens work on an IBIS alexa. both options are expensive for the customer to the point that you wished this new IBIS thing on cinema cameras weren't a thing and it would actually be more cost effective if you just bought a steady cam instead of buying new lenses and mounts and accessories. there are also purists out there who like using vintage cinema lenses that's just chunky and made of metal that weighs more than a fucking battery. i can go on and on about this but you guys get the point. as for the auto focus. most of the cinema lenses do not support auto focus anyways. again, to add auto focus into a cinema camera, you need lenses to fit the feature. same problems all over again. new lenses that costs more than your camera is not an enticing thing to hear. so again, just invest on focus pulling since cinematographers like precision more than automated focus. wireless monitors. I completely agree with this one. JUST PUT A FUCKING BLUETOOTH FEATURE ALEXA AND RED, GOD DAMN IT. I CAN STREAM 4K ON TWITCH THAT IS SHARPER THAN A CHEF'S KNIFE FOR FUCK SAKE. wireless audio monitoring. on a film set that prioritizes quality more than anything, this idea is a no go. they need to be able to hear the real thing so when it comes to post production, there's not going to be problems. and these manufacturers like red and alexa caters to these types of productions. real time 3d tracking is not a priority for manufacturers. not everyone needs it and the editing software takes care of it anyways. there's also lots of work arounds for it and you guys should know, because you guys are vfx artists. at the end of the day, these big ass cameras are not meant to be operated by 1 or 3 people. it was designed with a whole crew of people in mind. these cameras are powerful work horses that when used properly in the hands of a master, can create amazing things. there are work around for a small crew to operate these or even by yourself. but at that point, what are you doing with a cinema camera anyways? just buy a sony a7 series or even the BMPCC 4k and 6k. if your purpose is for youtube, compression will fuck with your finished products anyways so all the horse power of your cinema camera is not going to be as effective. granted, it's going to look far more impressive. another thing is that these cinema cameras are made for large format. meaning it's meant to give an output that can be shown in a massive screen in theaters. that's what you're paying for. IT IS MEANT TO BE FOR CINEMA SCREENS NOT A COMPUTER MONITOR OR EVEN A PHONE SCREEN. so yeah, these equipment are so overkill. these are just my views on this. it all comes down to how we all look at it.

  • My bathtub can run Crisis

  • i wonder when 'crysis' (a 13 year old game) will no longer be the benchmark for computing power XD

  • I really love the editing in this video. Nice work!

  • What I wonder is why don't movie cameras have triple sensors. On would think that it's a no-brainer. More light, less noise and artifacts. And a couple more measly sensors and a dichroic prism shoudn't be be an issue for Hollywood studios who throw 100s of millions on movies. Also like double the pixel number at an instant. Which would be good for at least for anti-aliasing without loss of quality. But also might be used later for higher resolution masters

  • Gopro rigs, got it.

  • what i would like to see in a camera in 2020? Corridor Crew. ....... ha..... get it..... cause your in the camera when being filmed..........................i'm so lonely.

  • This is in stark contrast with the linus techtips video, what happened?

  • Niko: It is the year 2020. There is not a better time to be alive if you are an independent filmmaker. 2020 :

  • sounds like the c300 mark iii

  • Kind of a good argument against capitalism. Progress is halted in the name of profit.

  • Sadly, as much as it would be dope to have these features I agree that the main focus for these brands are big features. It'd be dope if they'd come out with camera series meant for run and gun filming! Instead of Red Cinema Cameras, they'd have Red Indie Cameras (working title...). Anyways, a feature I'd love to see (coming from a lighting department side) is somehow implement data tracking of light fixtures into camera. Similar to recording camera setting/data. Being able to sync up light fixtures and see color temp, brightness, placement within the camera data or log so in post I'd be able to see if there was a problem (huh why is that side light look weird), or even help give VFX artist info to recreate object with the right lighting. I guess basically jamming a dimming board into a camera file lol...

  • "there is not a better time to be alive" - please reconsider!

  • There's something crazy you can do on LVcd. You have to click and hold the red line in the video and drag it to the right. I know it's a lot of work, definitely more work than the crew when making this video. But if you get to skip the *horrible* add then it is so worth it. And screw that Jake guy, he is so annoying. He's definitely a horrible human being, it's not like him and most of the crew have families and houses they need to take care of. Impossible.

  • I wish that there was a camera that could film your dreams and your imagination.

  • red is a company that steals money from stupid people so dont expect them to include that cool things to their cameras

  • Then why did you buy a RED.......

  • Same reason the Bugatti Chiron has no infotainment system. Future-proofing and redundancy.

  • Wow. All of a sudden it's like Niko and his crew are first year film students working on a high school play. There is a simple reason why everything isn't converged, cost. There's also another reason, propriety firmware and security. Yes, a phone can do a lot of things, but a lot of things they were talking about are part of apps you download to a phone. Software wise has your phone ever screwed up? Gotten a virus? Slowed down? Wouldn't start? Had a software feature that crashed? You think the designers of Red cameras want you spending thousands for one of their cameras only to have a bunch of wildcards happen while you're filming? No, they don't. lol Once you introduce all these questionable features you start to accept a lot more liability for things going wrong. You want everything converged for your movie, use a cellphone. More serious filmmakers will use the higher grade cameras and take the time to get it right in post. He talked about automatic image stabilization. I laughed, because that feature was created for all the over the shoulder, documentary style filmmaking people have been doing for 20+ years. Maybe just try buying a steady cam and keeping the shot smoother to begin with and stop using the auto feature as a crutch? Audio? I think of TVs. If TVs get flatter over time that means they don't have enough room for speakers. Speakers on flat TVs just suck. They will always suck. They aren't getting any better. So if you're a setting up a home theatre and get yourself a 65" TV or maybe a 100" screen for a projector, are you going to use the TV or projector's audio option? If you're going to be serious - No. You're going to get a soundbar or an amplifier with dedicated speakers separate of the product. That's why these high end cameras don't have these things. I'm all for indie filmmaking but there is no one stop shop on some of these devices for a reason. Red is about resolution, speed and compatibility. They also cater to multi million dollar film projects, not the indie scene. They're trying to maintain the reputation as much as they can. In conclusion of my Ted Talk, lol, thanks to movie theatres closing and the general industry tanking due to shrinking budgets that means companies like RED may make a line of cameras for the indie market and more features added, but I wouldn't hold my breath until the last big movie studio is out of business.

  • Remember when they were roasting Linus complaining about RED cameras and their price model where you spend 50k on a brick that doesn't do much by itself

  • This is actually so tru...I also thought of that, like no front to my a7sii and the "5-axis-sensor-stabilization, but the iPhone Stabilization...damn...

  • No high end professional production would trust any sort of AF. They have a person to do that. It's similar with the other problems you mentioned. These big cinema cameras aren't meant to be used for LVcd and run and go. Sure, it would be nice to have those features, but most productions wouldn't use them, so why even bother. These cameras are meant to deliver the highest quality possible and to do that you don't rely on AF and crappy Bluetooth audio. Also digital stabilisation (similar to smartphones) is just inferior to a gimbal or Steadicam.

  • Awesome Video and suggestions

  • I agree with Corridor that the best camera would incorporate all of the features that they listed. I think it's a pity that cinema cameras don't have autofocus and worse yet, IBIS. That being said, I have a couple of thoughts: The video is titled "features cameras should have but don't." This isn't a video about cameras in general, rather RED's line up of cameras. They consistently refer to the high price tag of the RED camera for a reason why more features should be included. At the end of the video, Corridor asks the audience "how is the best way to use this camera if I were the only person using it?" Most of the features that they listed would make the camera easier for single-operator use, however what they didn't consider is that RED cameras are designed for large crews, not individuals. Worse yet, their positions are closely guarded by unions, which constantly battle camera manufacturers to cut back on new features like the ones Corridor mentioned. RED would never put autofocus on one of their cameras because if they did, many focus pullers would lose their jobs. It's frustrating to see all of the technology scattered through the market in consumer cameras but not in the more expensive cinema cameras. However, the purpose of the cinema cameras is not only to make movies, but also to protect the jobs of those using them.

  • An old one that still annoys me: some modern dslrs still max out at 30 seconds of exposure. Not to protect the hardware or anything, it's just an arbitrary limit. You can switch to a clunky 'bulb mode' for a longer exposure, but then you have to physically hold down the shutter button for X minutes. Or buy a separate piece of gear that toggles it. Why do I need to switch to a special mode and have a battery operate remote control tell my camera that I want a 3 minute exposure, when they could just put a 3 minute option in the menu?

  • Maybe they could split the pro stuff into two separate lines? The super pro stuff for all the poeple working on singular aspects of it, and a reduced crew indy pro line up?

  • time for a company to swoop in and help corridor crew build their dream camera

  • A ferarri can't transport a dozen 10 foot long 2x4s without janky workarounds, whereas many cars a fraction of the cost can do this easily. Horses for courses. A red camera is not a good idea for a solo run and gun indie filmmaker.

  • Because CGI is meant to be added in later during post-production, not on scene.

  • yeah 2020, what a time to be alive

  • There literally is a TeraDek module for Red DSMC2....

  • I realize I'm coming to the conversation rather late, but I wanted to bring up an angle that I felt wasn't addressed by the video. These sorts of higher-end production cameras are expected to be used by full crews of people, with the footage coming from them to be later edited to match the specific vision of the filmmaker. By making these sorts of automated changes to the results (specifically in regards to auto-focus and stabilization), you would be trading control of the footage for greater ease in editing a specific way. In those terms, having separate modules to handle those (i.e., steadyXP, etc.) allows the production crew to tailor their tools to match a specific vision. If these things were integrated directly into the cameras, there would be less incentive for outside companies to release products to improve on these aspects, and greater incentive for camera companies to lock their systems down to proprietary software/hardware, resulting in restrictions in the options available to filmmakers. Camera systems like goPro and phone cameras, however, are made with the expectation that they'll primarily be used by individuals, without the backing of a team of people to edit the end footage into precisely what they wanted. Customers like that get automated systems because "good enough" is plenty good enough. As far as wireless feed monitoring and all that goes, yeah, it should be natively supported.

  • I'll at least say this: I think bluetooth audio would be really bad. I already am annoyed when it comes to the 30 seconds it takes to pair wireless headphones just to my phone to listen to music, now everytime I turn off my camera to make set adjustments or move rigs I've got to deal with those thirty seconds? Nah... But I'm sure if someone was to integrate it, they'd obviously have a wired and a wireless option, so it's really not that big anyway...

  • i think Sony did a great step into future tech with it´s Sony FX9 you got the Gyroscope data where you can do the stabilisation in post with a button and more maby there will be an application where you can use this data for tracking etc also it have the great sony autofocus and u you re able to shoot up to 16bit Raw and this for under 15k

  • "Tin foil hat territory" It's not, though. Planned obsolescence is a proven thing among tech manufacturers, and from a sales perspective it makes perfect sense not to make a product that removes the need for a new one.

  • So true!

  • Nobody: Corridor: puts a $1k photo lens on a $20k Cinema camera (RED) and complains about missing autofocus...

  • I think they also want to protect the industry, say if a high end pro camcorder does operate alone pretty well, then ACs will be out of jobs.

  • It's weird seeing this video coming from the same people that were bashing Linus for saying RED is too expensive.

  • Anyway, I think the main reason why the more expensive camera gets the less features it has, is because the goal of the manufacturer like ARRI or RED is to provide the best image they can and the best reliability. Having better autofocus, IBIS or wireless video out are things that can lead into comprises either in quality or in development time.

  • Yes yes , i want a jeep that runs like formula 1 sport car and fly an on weekend to new york, with solar system panels, and i wanna pay no more than 1000dls. dude!!! stop using weed!!

  • Spelt Oculus wrong ha. But agree, so many of these features would be so simple to add

  • 3d tracking is really really needed!!! i just dont understamd why they dont implement that. so many tines i have spent hours trying to manually recreate a 3d cam in post for shots which were not possinke to track by software, often shots of people moving with optical blyr everywhere else (this is the worst). and there is not any external solution for this! even the stabilization module you presented doenst do this eben if it collect the datas! are they dumb? this would give a second purpose to the product!

  • Basically a game that’s mostly DLC

  • for built in CGI, look at Matt Workman's (cinematography database) set up -- Live keying using a virtual reality hand unit on the camera, wireless video transmitting keyed footage to operator monitor. He has a streamlined set up as well that takes the camera out and works in Unreal Engine.

  • Wireless transmitter companies make great wireless transmitters. Lens companies (and camera manufacturers) make great lenses. 3rd parties make amazing image stabilization rigs (that can be used with any camera), so the added cost and, frankly, inferior, built-in stabilization of consumer and "pro-sumer" cameras isn't needed or preferred by professional DoPs who make the movies audiences pay $17 to see, and if something goes wrong with this extra, built-in technology, you have to replace the camera instead of the support: have you heard the expression, "Jack of all trades, master of none"? Honestly, if the Go-pro didn't have a super-wide angle lens, its image stabilization wouldn't look particularly good.

  • 8:00 wireless monitoring My 30$ rip off of a gopro can do it

  • Hey Man Fan of your video....

  • Corridor Crew, I have a question for you. Would you want to have all the things you mentioned in the video but you could only ever shoot 1080p, or would you want access to 2.7K, 4K, 5.5K, 6K, 8K, and all the other K's that the future has to offer. Not an argument, I'm just curious on your choice.

  • to be able to look at what you're filming and put a rough version of the effects your planning to use to see if it is working.

  • 8k video module that dumps the raw data directly to wifi/ethernet and a program to process it or edit it real time on a pc.

  • But wouldn't at least half of those missing features make manpower an thus certain jobs obsolete? Just saying.

  • Solution: implement it yourself but be sure to make it open source

  • the d5300 has Bluetooth monitoring

  • This video hit me so hard.

  • Simple don't buy their products. Put pressure on the sales reps/higher ups.

  • bluetooth audio has annoying latency :(

  • You guys shoukd be fine with buying an Alexa SXT W

  • lvcd.info/watch/tMKJhIGko5ehank/video.html zero movie break down

  • I kinda feel this way about video game consoles at this point, obviously different issues, but as Niko says “the processing power should be there.” Imagine the speed if 3-D tracking just disappeared from all movies.

  • I want my camera to have a special gun, so when you take a picture or a video of someone, it will kill coronavirus. Best build in 2020 for sure

  • Reasons: Autofocus: The camera doesn't know what story you are trying to tell. These are cinema cameras for story telling and focus is part of the story. Canon cameras are designed for the run and gun sort of thing you're talking about. Wireless monitoring: BMPCC4K can already do this with a $6 app. For high end cinema cameras it would make the lifespan of the camera much worse because wireless technology becomes outdated very quickly. It reminds me of those DVD/VHS combos that were trash in a month. It is not hard to put a wireless system on, especially on a cinema project. 3D tracking: This actually sounds very cool and practical if done well. Done well is the very problem, at this point the tech is far to niche to justify millions of dollars in R&D for something a handful of people would pay for. Bluetooth headphones: Cinema is going to involve dialogue and complicated audio setups. Meaning they will not be recording the audio directly to the camera, they will have a multitrack recorder synced with timecode. The audio technician is going to have accurate monitoring headphones and not consumer bluetooth headphones. These are not cameras made for making quick action heavy short films. That is to small of a market at this point to justify cameras specifically designed for it. I appreciate starting a dialogue about these pieces of tech being added, but it is dangerous to ask for things that will probably hinder most people who are professionals in this field. I have seen the same thing happen to photography cameras where they add too many vlogging features and it makes the camera less useful for photography.

  • Lenses, sensor size, resolution, light sensitiviy, processing power, and I could probably think of more things that make it expensive.

  • Can they make a movie without auto shake cam remove

  • Anybody know what the music is that plays in the beginning of this video?

  • I think you're over-generalizing with the 3d tracking feature. Most, or all, real-time tracking is not accurate enough for final 4k production quality. Many production shots are difficult to track for dedicated tracking software with intelligent human assist. If the in-camera tracking is off by a few pixels, at any time - and it will be - you have to go in and fix it with software anyway. Its a passable gimmick for iPhones and consumer cameras, but not productions that are spending $100's of thousands or millions on a single shot in which it has to be perfect. It might be useable for pre-vis and conceptualizing.

  • So Niko, MAKE YOUR OWN CAMERA COMPANY. You guys have access to so many tools and people and it would be AMAZING.

  • don't know about Red but if Blackmagic design gonna watch this video they may put some of these features in next generation Pocket cinema camera . but how they don't name it Pocket cinema camera lol

  • If I did all this and had the quality of RED would you buy my product

  • You can hack the red software to add your own they have terrible secerity

  • all of this stuff is so true